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A real live drum test... for real... no really. (New Sample)

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WATYF
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Age: 100

Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 9:20 pm Post subject: A real live drum test... for real... no really. (New Sample)

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[EDIT]Scroll down for the new sample... or listen to both of 'em (which I wouldn't recommend Razz

Razz

)[/EDIT]

OK... so enough of that farting around with only a couple mics. Now on to the real deal. I got rid of the old thread so as not to take up space on the front page... so here's all the information worth repeating. Razz

Razz

Here's the gear being used...

(1) M-Audio Octane - Mic Pre's
(3) Sennheiser E604 - Toms
(2) Oktava MC012 - OH's
(1) Shure Beta 52A - Kick
(1) Shure SM58 - Snare

Here's a fully mic'ed sample of me dinking around like a doofus for a minute or so. Razz

Razz

This is my first time mic'ing/tracking my own kit, so let me know your impressions of the overall sound. What's too loud.. what sounds like @ss... what you would do better... you know... the usual. Mr. Green

Mr. Green

WATYF

DrumTest2.mp3

Description:

Dink, dinky dink dink.

Filename:

DrumTest2.mp3

Filesize:

1.75

Downloaded:

454 Time(s)

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Last edited by WATYF on Sat Aug 28, 2004 10:54 am; edited 1 time in total

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mixmkr
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Joined: 08 Nov 2003
Posts: 803

Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 10:34 pm Post subject:

yeah...you got rif of the old thread because you realized that the Taylor should be mine!!

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WATYF
Supreme Overlord

Age: 100

Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 10:43 pm Post subject:

I'm just living in a perpetual state of denial. WATYF _________________ Quote o' the Month: Since I needed exactly that exactly then, you are my temporary hero....subject to change without advanced notice. - Zlurgh Shameless self-promotion: Read my blog. Try my software.

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erichenryus
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Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 1989
Location: Near Chicago

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 3:29 am Post subject:

Sounds great to me! Can't be picky cause I'm listening on computer speakers but I really like the bass drum. Did you do anything to the room? Just set them up and go? Also, did you buy a matched set of mc012's or just bought two of them? Sorry so many questions, I'm moving into a new house next week. And I have space for recording real drums finally. I think my shopping list is gonna look suspiciously a lot like yours. Thanks.

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joro

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:49 am Post subject:

nice man...you are ready to go now man.... Do it up! Joe

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L J Max
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Joined: 11 Dec 2003
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Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:55 am Post subject:

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Sounds good to my ears Smile

Smile

If you need a song to add drums too you are welcome to use Love Ain't Got No Heart. Wink

Wink

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capablehands

Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 488

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:46 am Post subject:

very cool, ain't real drums the best? only thing that stands out a bit is a ringing on the snare - maybe throw a muffler ring on it or find it and notch it out with eq. looking forward to hearing some tunes! jeff

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Dethska
...the other WATYF

Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 8549
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Age: 31

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:14 am Post subject:

Snare sucks dude! Gotta muffle it with something. Throw an o-ring or something on it. That ringing just blows. I mean, come on, it's absolutely horrible. Oh yeah, I'm being incredibly harsh because you totally nailed the kick, toms, cymbals etc. Your toms sound like what I've been trying to achieve for over a year. So I'm jealous as hell and all mad and stuff

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WATYF
Supreme Overlord

Age: 100

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:35 am Post subject:

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erichenryus wrote:

Did you do anything to the room? Just set them up and go?

Also, did you buy a matched set of mc012's or just bought two of them?

Sorry so many questions, I'm moving into a new house next week. And I have space for recording real drums finally. I think my shopping list is gonna look suspiciously a lot like yours. Smile

Smile

Thanks.

I didn't treat the room at all... it's in my basement, which the former owners "finished" by throwing up cheap, fake wood panneling and putting something that feels like felt on the floor. My basement goes in a U shape, though, so the drums are all the way at the end in a 10X10 (or so) area where they're pretty much closed in. It helps a lot to get rid of any reflections or excess natural reverb.

I got the 012's used (from a post on HR.com). The guy said that they weren't technically "matched", but he had four to sell and he said he would pick out the two that had the closest freq responce. I think they turned out pretty nice.

Feel free to steal all my ideas on the drum gear (not that they were my ideas anyway Razz

Razz

). I spent a buttload of time researching every detail aboot all the different elements. I think those E604's rock (and btw, if you want to buy them, I'll give you the number of a place that sells them way cheaper then the "musiciansfriend" type places) and I'm pretty satisfied with the Octane.

WATYF
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WATYF
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Age: 100

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:41 am Post subject:

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Dethska wrote:

Snare sucks dude! Very Happy

Very Happy

Gotta muffle it with something. Throw an o-ring or something on it. That ringing just blows. I mean, come on, it's absolutely horrible.

I'm not really fond of drum rings.... actually... I'm quite un-fond of them. Razz

Razz

They're too much of a quick fix, that ends up breaking more than they fix. Sure, I can muffle the life out of the snare and that'll get rid of the ring.... and the tone... and the resonance... and the character... Razz

Razz

I plan on tuning it a little more until I find a sweet spot, then using a gate to keep the snare from having such a long decay. Just the gate alone would take care of most of the "noticeable" ring... tuning it just right would probably eliminate the problem altogether.

WATYF
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St. Ian
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Joined: 25 Jun 2004
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Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:59 am Post subject:

Lovely.. except for the snare. But I see you`re fixing that. Good job! _________________ Wet socks are uncool. www.myspace.com/stisim www.myspace.com/insanityperfected

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kramer

Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 7341

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:15 am Post subject:

The whole kit sounds great man.Snare sounds excellent.

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Voxxy Brown
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
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Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:33 am Post subject:

I'd like to hear a bit more eq on this kit. Sounds a bit "flat" to me. I like to hear a bit more seperation in the drums ( I know that goes against everything about having a "kit" LOL) I always try and keep everything as seperated sounding in a drum mix. So the snare, hat, and kick and everything sort of have there own little territory. But thats really my only nitpick. All in all this sounds decent man! Great playing. You totally smoke me. I don't even come close. LOL _________________

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Dethska
...the other WATYF

Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 8549
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Age: 31

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 9:06 am Post subject:

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WATYF wrote:

Dethska wrote:

Snare sucks dude! Very Happy

Very Happy

Gotta muffle it with something. Throw an o-ring or something on it. That ringing just blows. I mean, come on, it's absolutely horrible.

I'm not really fond of drum rings.... actually... I'm quite un-fond of them. Razz

Razz

They're too much of a quick fix, that ends up breaking more than they fix. Sure, I can muffle the life out of the snare and that'll get rid of the ring.... and the tone... and the resonance... and the character... Razz

Razz

I plan on tuning it a little more until I find a sweet spot, then using a gate to keep the snare from having such a long decay. Just the gate alone would take care of most of the "noticeable" ring... tuning it just right would probably eliminate the problem altogether.

WATYF

Bah! Snare isn't supposed to have tone or character. It's just gotta pop. I mean haven't you heard the latest offering from that one band. Their snare doesn't have any tone or character. Why do you think YOU need it? Razz

Razz

I'd love to hear what you can accomplish with tuning and gating. I hate muffling my toms and snare. But it's the only way I've found to even come close to the tone I want. I hate ringing.

BTW- what heads are you using? And can you give me a general idea how they are tuned (loose bottom, tight top, medium snare, etc. etc.). Thanks.

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WATYF
Supreme Overlord

Age: 100

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 10:51 am Post subject:

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Voxxy Brown wrote:

I'd like to hear a bit more eq on this kit. Sounds a bit "flat" to me. I like to hear a bit more seperation in the drums ( I know that goes against everything about having a "kit" LOL) I always try and keep everything as seperated sounding in a drum mix. So the snare, hat, and kick and everything sort of have there own little territory.

I put some EQ on the overall kit to brighten it up a little. I've got pretty distinct seperation going on in it already (and a little more in the latest sample). Toms are really wide, hat has it's own space, snare it just left of center.

Dethska wrote:

Bah! Snare isn't supposed to have tone or character. It's just gotta pop. I mean haven't you heard the latest offering from that one band. Their snare doesn't have any tone or character. Why do you think YOU need it? Razz

Razz

I'd love to hear what you can accomplish with tuning and gating. I hate muffling my toms and snare. But it's the only way I've found to even come close to the tone I want. I hate ringing.

BTW- what heads are you using? And can you give me a general idea how they are tuned (loose bottom, tight top, medium snare, etc. etc.). Thanks.

LOL... right... what was I thinking... that one band totally uses a muffled-to-death snare and they're cool! Mr. Green

Mr. Green

I use Aquarian Double Thin Coated for snare and toms... I'm thinking aboot switching to a different kind... I dunno. Sometimes I just don't think they're right for this kit.

Anyway... here's a new test sample. Even more of me dinking around... for even longer this time (I edited out all the boring stuff, like me tuning the snare and just hitting crap randomly. Razz

Razz

)

Here are my conclusions thus far, which most of you have confirmed:

1) After some screwing around with it, I've decided that I need a new snare. Mr. Green

Mr. Green

(the only logical conclusion, of course). The snare I have is the not-so-great one that came with the kit... it's noisy (i.e. lots of snare buzz and other resonant ringing/funky stuff) For now, I will probably just muffle the life oat of it, just because that stupid ringing is way more annoying than a snare with no character. (seeing how we hear that every day on the radio. Razz

Razz

)

2) I need to tune/work-with the toms some more. The low tom especially... it's got an odd decay.

Question... anyone think the kick is too loud? I've got pretty lousy bass response on my monitors. I need to know if I'm overdoing it.

WATYF

DrumTest3.mp3

Description:

Dinker, dinker, doo...

Filename:

DrumTest3.mp3

Filesize:

4.14

Downloaded:

290 Time(s)

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Sonic
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Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 12:46 pm Post subject:

Dude...not a bad recording at all. I like the ring in snares....remember it'll dissapear alot when other tracks get in there. On average it sounds a bit muffled but you should hear my drum tracks before all the gack goes into it....Whoever said snares don't have character must be a guitar player and should stop smoking crack (just ribb'n ya Dethska) IMO Everything has to have character otherwise it's just another crappy snare you can find anywhere. Nothing like being able to hear a snare and pick out many characteristics. I think the kick could use a bit more sub freqs. It's all coming along nicely dude. _________________ Sonic Sound Design Resource :: Studio Site :: Game Site

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capablehands

Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 488

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 12:55 pm Post subject:

very nice! you've got a very relaxed feel. as far as the sound - needs a bit more brightness. i'm wondering do you have any eq on the overheads? maybe roll off some bottom end and nudge a little on the highs. kick is nice and bright - might need a little more bottom - try moving the mic a bit back from the front head. in any case you're ready to rock! jeff

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Bulls Hit
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Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 2335

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:42 pm Post subject:

Yeh I quite like a bit of ring in the snare. Everything else sounds great. I'm wondering how much of your snare sound is from the 58, & how much from the oheads. To me it's just lacking a little crispness, that more ohead can add, or a little eq boost in the upper area

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WATYF
Supreme Overlord

Age: 100

Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:13 pm Post subject:

The 58 gives the snare more mid-range presense... if I take it down, you can still hear the snare from the OHs but it's a lot thinner. I will be applying a lot more processing once I do a real mix for the next song I do (whatever that may be)... so the OHs will most likely be a little brighter. And yeah, even though the snare has a bit of a ring, once it's mixed in with a full band, you'll never notice it... I don't reckon it's that much of a "real-world" problem. Maybe I'll just let it slide. Thanks for all the feedback... we'll see how it turns out in a full mix. WATYF _________________ Quote o' the Month: Since I needed exactly that exactly then, you are my temporary hero....subject to change without advanced notice. - Zlurgh Shameless self-promotion: Read my blog. Try my software.

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Dethska
...the other WATYF

Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 8549
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Age: 31

Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 10:21 am Post subject:

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Sonic wrote:

Whoever said snares don't have character must be a guitar player and should stop smoking crack (just ribb'n ya Dethska)

Egads

A guitar player?!!!!!

Them's fighting words. Luke

Luke

Oh wait, I do play guitar. But I also drum.

And I haven't smoked crack in . . . well, about three minutes now.

OMG

OMG

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badgas

Age: 61

Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 11:08 am Post subject:

Time to make some tunes. Congrats on your new tools. _________________ Some of you know me. Some of you don't. Either way, I don't envy you.

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M.Brane
Ultra Member

Age: 45

Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 3:12 pm Post subject:

The snare ring is good, but the ptich is way too low. The strainer is way too tight as well. Hitting harder would do wonders too for it, and the toms. Kick lacks body. Overheads are pretty nice. Just a tad harsh in the high-mids/low treble. Keep poundin'! From a guitarist _________________ "now all I need is money" - stainless

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b. sabbath
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Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 2375
Location: New York

Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 3:25 pm Post subject:

I picked up on a Neil feel.. sounds pretty good except for the snare.. I'm sure it's because of how it's tuned and ringing.. I don't think the ringing is good.. put some duck tape and paper towels on it.. sounds a little better on the second clip.. I started playing drums for a band again.. (5 piece Mapex) one day I'll try to record them.. for now I'm just trying to program what I play on the tunes for recording sakes.. _________________ www.myspace.com/samicidemusic

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WATYF
Supreme Overlord

Age: 100

Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2004 7:37 pm Post subject:

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b. sabbath wrote:

I picked up on a Neil feel..

Very observant of you, my good man... I have just a teensy, tiny bit of Peart influence... (considering I grew up drumming along to Rush albums Mr. Green

Mr. Green

)

b. sabbath wrote:

...put some duck tape and paper towels on it.. Smile

Smile

LOL... I thought I was the only one who did that. Wink

Wink

WATYF
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seka
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Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 2:23 am Post subject:

oh yeah, real drums!! so much better than those damn samples I am using , but the neighbours you know... I'd like to hear these drums in a full mix, it's difficult to make any comments on the sound when you don't hear the rest of the instruments. I would definitely give the kick some more bottom _________________ * flip your wig * www.superbox.be www.myspace.com/superbox

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