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 drum overheads- LDC versus SDC
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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 2:21 pm    Post subject: drum overheads- LDC versus SDC Reply with quote

pros and cons? I'm using a pair of the MXL Mogami 603s, but I have a pair of Jolie modded Oktava MK-319's which aren't seeing much activity-

would you use LDC's over SDC's , and if so would you place them closer to the cymbals, position them more like a stereo pair

Yeah. I know I could just change them out and have a listen... but I'm basically a lazy SOB Rolling Eyes

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nomad1970 Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've used the 603's for overheads before - they do a good job. I've also used LDC's, but prefer SDC's for this application. (not just because of sound, they are easier to maneuver)

I always use spaced pair for overheads. On the ride side of the kit, I usually point it straight down, aimed halfway between the bell and the rim. Height, 2 feet or so above the highest cymbal on that side of the kit.

Hi-Hat side, a little higher. Usually try to get snare as centered as possible, but this can be compensated with level adjustment.

Lots of variables recording drums, I tend to keep it as simple as possible though. 2 overheads, one mic per tom, one on snare, one on kick.
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tmix Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have always prefered mid sized diameter diaphramed mics to true small diaphrams, so I guess the large diaphrams would be similar.
You have less transient response with larger mics so some of the shimmer goes away but on the good side if they are not bright mics the cymbals won't rule the mix.

I would think the Oktavas to be a good mic to try since they are generally a darker mic.

I use a modified Recorderman mic set up and like it a lot.
I use 2 mid diameter tube mics for my overheads.

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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I may give it a try. My overhead "mounts" are from a beam out/down (seemed an easier way to have one two mic stands to deal with... and I just ordered some "mini-boom with swivel arms at the end to give me some flexibility with placement

I using 2 overheads, which also picks up one of the small, another mic over the mid and large, kick, snare, and one on the hat

The Jolie Mods greatly helped lighten the "darkness" the Oktavas had.... in fact I almost sold them instead of getting the mods as i didn't like them at all stock. It was money well spent and they're definitely not bright... IMHO the 603s are the more brighter

There's a mod for the 603's (3 caps) which is supposed to make a noticeable difference, and there's also taking out some of the "grill" around the capsule... and I have omni and cardioid capsules

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freesalsa Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tmix wrote:

You have less transient response with larger mics so some of the shimmer goes away but on the good side if they are not bright mics the cymbals won't rule the mix.
.


Do you have ANYTHING other than your opinion to support this comment?
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And do you have anything other than your attitude to support your challenge? Why do you think he might not be reporting his experience?
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freesalsa Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dobro wrote:
And do you have anything other than your attitude to support your challenge? Why do you think he might not be reporting his experience?


Yes I do.
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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

would you care to share it with the rest of us?... or must we play 20 questions?

I'm interested in any/all experiences/opinions, both anecdotal and those based on fact

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freesalsa Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fact is that the overall weight of the diaphragm effects transient response, NOT circumference.

I will take a mod'ed U87 over just about any SDC! A Klaus Heyne mod'ed U87 will smoke the transient response of any sub $1500 SDC!

There are so many other issues that come into play concerning how a mic will color sound. To wrap it all up with "SDC have better transient response" and suggest that somehow you lose "shimmer" because of the difference is a very misguided opinion. I have often found that the smearing effect of a slower transient response will in effect kill off some of that harsh 5KHz that many cheaper SDC's exhibit! This effect will often give my "shimmer" by simply taking away harshness.

If you equate harshness with shimmer, then we will just have to agree to disagree about what describes what in music. Wink
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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

would not the diameter directly impact the overall movement possible movement of the diaphragm away from a resting state "plane"? I can see how the weight would have an impact, but this would be both material and thickness relative to diameter. A smaller diaphragm would need more 'flex' which I'm thinking (and perhaps incorrectly) to respond in a similar fashion tot he same transient sonic force (SPL?)- which would seem to mean (to me) that LDC and SDC's will not respond the same in most all cases

or I'm I off on a misguided tangent here?

for those of us not in the $1K plus mic range, do you have any thoughts which us mere mortals might

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freesalsa Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The diameter is only relevant in regards to it's ratio in the mass equation (oooo...that sounds smart!) concerning transient response.

Indeed, at the same diaphragm thickness at different diameters are part of the equation.

There is more to this LDC vs SDC and how they effect sound, and what is better for recording what than a simple statement like "SDC's have better transient response and will produce better 'shimmer'".

You would be surprised how many big time recordings are done using LDC's as overheads. I don't hear a lack of 'shimmer' in those recordings!
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