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rudibass2 Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 10:09 am    Post subject: more drummers to be unemployed Reply with quote

Steve3PO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COl1xmWAjUw



I got the same feeling I had back in the seventies when I walked into a club and heard my first rhythm machine with a one man band !!! Confused Thumb Down

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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's a place for it, but not a very big place.
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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe I'll be dead and long gone before any form of midi/digital drummer is able to work with the rest of the band from visual cues- that "chemistry" that happens from human interaction is gonna be one tough algorithm to write!
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Stainless ....

I wish I could be traded like a penny in the arcade for a token to be played
on a cello strung with strings that are my dreams



Check out our music at http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/stainlessbrown[/url]
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly. For the last couple of nights, I've been watching 'Here Is What Is', a video of Daniel Lanois working in the studio, both recording and mixing, interspersed with lots of talk and conversations. It's a really interesting, even informative view, but what really *inspired* me was how he doesn't overdub much. He's got the whole band playing together in the studio for the sake of the interaction. It made me want to find people to play with in the studio and do the same. For the last year or so, I've abandoned overdubbing guitar and vocal, and I've returned to playing and singing at the same time. And most of those instances, I've also abandoned playing and singing to a click track. I just much, much prefer the 'just play and sing the song' way of proceeding. YMMV
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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many of the drummers I work with... OK 2 of 4... prefer a click- while it keeps the song from speeding up/slowing down... I'm OK with it, but I've observed (biased ... maybe a bit) that the the non click tracks, even if some of the instruments are re-tracked, maintains that "live" feel.

I like being able to make eye contact with everyone to signal "get ready, watch and run with it"- this can be as subtle as bringing the energy up/down, accentuating a run at a bridge, or extending/signaling the end of a solo.

I've a number of tunes (some posted here) that were posted with the disclaimer "contains scratch tracks" only to end up keeping the original track, background noise and all

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Stainless ....

I wish I could be traded like a penny in the arcade for a token to be played
on a cello strung with strings that are my dreams



Check out our music at http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/stainlessbrown[/url]
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Lt. Bob Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's NOTHING better than that live interaction with good players.

When you're all playing and then, for some reason, look at each other and *ZOOM* head off into something unexpected and everyone goes there together ........ those are magical moments.
Plus, I like playing with other players so they can tell me how awesome I am.

Mr. GreenMr. Green

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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lt.


you're AWESOME man!!!!

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Stainless ....

I wish I could be traded like a penny in the arcade for a token to be played
on a cello strung with strings that are my dreams



Check out our music at http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/stainlessbrown[/url]
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the inhabitant Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO, the only purpose for a click is to train a 5th graders in band class how to play in tempo.
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO, the reason my collaborators ask me for a click is cuz they know that without one, I'll stray from the tempo. Cool

This next bit's for Stainless as well: without a click, and without overdubbing vocals and guitar, I have to pay a *lot* of my recording attention to tempo and intonation. The interesting thing is that when I do this, it doesn't detract from the feeling of the song, because the energy required to concentrate on tempo and intonation seems to feed the emotion at the same time. A triad of factors. Success.

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scrubs Offline
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:29 pm    Post subject: Re: more drummers to be unemployed Reply with quote

rudibass2 wrote:
Steve3PO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COl1xmWAjUw



I got the same feeling I had back in the seventies when I walked into a club and heard my first rhythm machine with a one man band !!! Confused Thumb Down


Hey, it's better than Lars at his own parts.

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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe it to be true that often the first take is the best, as your focus is on playing the song, rather than analyzibng what you did before and how you're going to play it different

having said that- it took me 70+ takes on one of KDubs tunes before I could get it right start to finish- sure I could have cut-n-pasted it together.... but that always has seemed like cheating to me

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Stainless ....

I wish I could be traded like a penny in the arcade for a token to be played
on a cello strung with strings that are my dreams



Check out our music at http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/stainlessbrown[/url]
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a confident delivery, it's really useful to KNOW a tune as well as you know your way around your own bedroom in the dark. Hence, the seventy takes on that collab you did.

As for 'the first take is often the best take' - the first take's got freshness, for sure. But I find that the energy I put into subsequent takes to focus on 'getting it right' is often the price of admission for getting it better too, just as long as I'm still willing to take chances. It can take me further into the song if, while I'm focussed on getting it right, I balance that with being open to possibilities at the same time.

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stainless Offline
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dobro wrote:
with being open to possibilities at the same time.


I've been known to completely change/re-write a tune after a few takes before a new inspiration strikes- I wish I'd saved all the takes, as some of the changes have been pretty radical

blues shuffle -> funk -> jump -> country... etc


I talked with the guy who wrote "Unchain my heart" (Bobbie Sharp) when we were going to include it on a CD- Bobbie was living a street over from where i lived as a kid in the bay area! He worked in the 50's to early 60's [ I've read he had a drug problem which led to his demise in NY] for one of the clearing houses in NY as a songwriter- he'd go to work (regular 40 hour gig) and get assignments to write songs, either specifically for an artist) as in the case of Unchain, which was to be a planned pitch to Charles)- he said it would sometimes be a basic idea (relationship break-up) or a story line-

Bobbie sent me 6 un-released tunes with lyric sheets, some chords, and a cassette with him playing piano and singing- most i'd call "novelty song", but a couple I've revisited a few time... maybe someday... i have enough of my own I'd like to get recorded

but my point (if I have one) is how cool would it be to have your job be composing?

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Stainless ....

I wish I could be traded like a penny in the arcade for a token to be played
on a cello strung with strings that are my dreams



Check out our music at http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/stainlessbrown[/url]
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it was my job, it'd be scary. Since it's my free time joy, it's not scary - it's my free time joy.
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galichon Offline
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like someone combined their love of drums and robotics. Smile
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FrankenStrat Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something I've never tried yet, but could probably work: with a click track or let's say EZDrummer, vary the tempo every couple of bars. Not by much, maybe one or two beats difference. That should keep everyone together in the case of an online collab, and give a more live feel since the tempo keeps subtely changing.
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