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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 1:38 pm    Post subject: midi 101 Reply with quote

I know nothing about midi, so be gentle.

Does midi require a soundcard with midi functionality? Right now, the only thing on my system that looks like it can handle midi is:

Microsoft MIDI Mapper

Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth

These don't look very promising.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

not sure, but once you get a midi keyboard up and running (I assume thats what you want to do, in the old days I had 5 signal processors I used life, and a midi foot controller) I can take you from there thru it. I bought an M-audio 49 key controller <100 bucks, and it just worked. I pull up VI's and they work.
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Gidge Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: midi 101 Reply with quote

dobro wrote:
I know nothing about midi, so be gentle.

Does midi require a soundcard with midi functionality? Right now, the only thing on my system that looks like it can handle midi is:

Microsoft MIDI Mapper

Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth

These don't look very promising.


sounds like your soundcard is midi functional....but if you want to input midi you will need a usb controller.....I have the same one Joey mentioned......

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joeydego Offline
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it connects via a midi to usb cable, right into a usb port on your computer. It was class compliant for me, but came with a driver anyway as well as the cable. Plug up the midi keyboard, bring up some midi drums or reason or whatever and it should work.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, your soundcard does not do midi....your computer can play MIDI files via microsoft which is very different. A Controller as mentioned will give you midi input ability but if you have midi devices you want to use you will need a midi i/o box.

Oh...I am not going to work today...scheduling mishap, what time are we going to Ninjam?

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ramen Offline
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joeydego wrote:
it connects via a midi to usb cable, right into a usb port on your computer. It was class compliant for me, but came with a driver anyway as well as the cable. Plug up the midi keyboard, bring up some midi drums or reason or whatever and it should work.


yeah, this is how I roll too. Even my USB 1.1 connection plays nice with the controller.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have a usb or firewire keyboard, then you can do midi on your cpu.

If you have a midi keyboard without usb or firewire, then you either need a soundcard with midi ports, or you'll need a usb midi adapter.

USB midi adapters have been around a long time, about as long as usb itself, and should be pretty cheap. I like my Midiman (M-Audio) Midisport, but I don't really need its 2-in / 2-out setup. One in one out should be fine for most uses.

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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dafduc wrote:
If you have a usb or firewire keyboard, then you can do midi on your cpu.


Okay, so something like this will work simply by bunging it into one of my USB ports?

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Keystation88es-main.html

What does half-weighted mean? Half-assed piano key action?

Anyway, this is what the Help in my so-called MIDI-friendly version of Audition says about it:

"Windows transmits MIDI information internally between applications; to transmit MIDI information between your computer and external devices such as MIDI keyboards, you must use a hardware MIDI interface (for example, the MIDI In port of a sound card)."

It says 'for example', the other example being a USB keyboard, yes?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats the full size version of my 49 key. I havent looked at the back of it for a year, but I just checked and it actually has a usb out on it. So its usb out of the board to usb in on your puter. Half weighted means half assed piano feel. I dont play keys so I prefer them not weighted. The usb keyboard would be the hardware interface, yes.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, what Joey said. Half-weighted is nice, though - A little resistance really helps expressive playing, and won't slow you down the way fully-weighted keys will.
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks you guys. Really appreciate it.

All my life, I haven't wanted to be a mechanic. I've just wanted to drive the car.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

anytime, and please send my regards over to the aux bus, I promised I wouldnt post over there for a month.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Me too, so you'll have to find somebody else to pass on your regards. Cool
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, so I've got the keyboard figured out. Now, where do the sounds come from? Software synth packages, right? But are there programs which work with samples that can be midi-triggered?
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ramen Offline
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dobro wrote:
Okay, so I've got the keyboard figured out. Now, where do the sounds come from? Software synth packages, right? But are there programs which work with samples that can be midi-triggered?


Yeah, the sounds come from softsynths. Your DAW interface handles them the same way they would a DX or VST plugin. So basically you get your midi input setup, arm your track, load your softsynth and away you go. All that gets recorded is the midi info, so you can change synth sounds while you mix, or render the effect to free up cpu space while mixing.

There are a ton of them that work with samples. I do my drums on ez_drummer. Each drum hit has a range of velocities loaded and depending on how hard you play, etc... It also blends close and room mics and has it's own mixer. There are other sample based synths that play samples back at different pitches related to the key, ala a good ole Synclavier.

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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah, very cool being able to change the sound of the synth part later on if you want.

But you need to be able to hear what you're playing, so the synth sound you've loaded is played through the phones while you're recording, right?

I suppose if you were a geek you could run the signal to an external keyboard amp and mic it, too.

How close can a synth sound come to a real e-piano? Close-ish, right?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have digidesigns velvet and its indistinguishable from an old rhodes.
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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, so $250 for an epiano sound. Arturia make all sorts of packages for $200 each. MOTU has interesting stuff for $300.

So for two or three hundred dollars, you get a whole new instrument with a whole new range of voices.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the arturia stuff is very good, but resource hungry. Sounds like your really into keys and such. maybe I can turn you on to this http://www.propellerheads.se/ it will give you organs, epiano, piano, and more synth sounds than you will ever use, and a sequencer, all for 400 bucks.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dobro wrote:
Okay, so $250 for an epiano sound. Arturia make all sorts of packages for $200 each. MOTU has interesting stuff for $300.

So for two or three hundred dollars, you get a whole new instrument with a whole new range of voices.


You could try some free VSTi's to get your feet wet.

http://www.freesoundeditor.com/incageneng.html?VSTSyntheng.htm~main

Like you said, you need a DAW that will support Real-time effects so you can hear what you are playing in the headphones. Audition finally has real-time effects, right? Smile

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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joeydego wrote:
the arturia stuff is very good, but resource hungry. Sounds like your really into keys and such. maybe I can turn you on to this http://www.propellerheads.se/ it will give you organs, epiano, piano, and more synth sounds than you will ever use, and a sequencer, all for 400 bucks.


Very cool. Thanks for that link.

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dobro Offline
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ramen wrote:
dobro wrote:
Okay, so $250 for an epiano sound. Arturia make all sorts of packages for $200 each. MOTU has interesting stuff for $300.

So for two or three hundred dollars, you get a whole new instrument with a whole new range of voices.


You could try some free VSTi's to get your feet wet.

http://www.freesoundeditor.com/incageneng.html?VSTSyntheng.htm~main

Like you said, you need a DAW that will support Real-time effects so you can hear what you are playing in the headphones. Audition finally has real-time effects, right? Smile


Yeah, I'll try the free stuff before I ante up for something that requires cash dollars. Thanks.

And yeah, my editor has handled realtime fx since Cool Edit 2, and vst stuff since Audition 1.5. The latest offering, Audition 3, is even getting into simple midi capacity and is bundled with a ton of loops and an onboard metronome! No stone left unturned in Adobe's desire to sell their stuff to more than just radio guys. (Meanwhile, the homerecording crowd has more or less migrated in hordes over to Reaper, something the big boys have yet to become aware of...)

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ramen Offline
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Argur is a cool free one.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

good free vsti's:

Rhodes: Mr. Ray
piano: mdaPiano
clavinet: TickyKlav
synth: mda JX-10
organ: um, Rumpelrausch isn't terrible, but it's no B-4. B-4 is totally totally awesome. Totally.

You should find links for most of these at www.kvraudio.com .

Daf

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, good ideas. Thanks, Daf. Thanks, Ramen.
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